Timbaland Steals from the demoscene?

Maybe it's interesting to look here.

http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/2.5/legalcode http://creativecommons.org/ http://www.creativecommons.nl/meer/index.php http://www.creativecommons.nl/meer/faq.php (dit gedeelte is belangrijk om te lezen denk ik)

Wat ik eruit opmaak snel voor als zoiets zal gebeuren. Dus dat iemand jouw voorwaarden van de creative commons licentie niet na leefd. En dus toch net als timbafake jouw werkt voor commerciële doeleinden gebruikt.

(dit staat er dus op die site van creative commons nederland)

Welke stappen kan ik ondernemen als iemand inbreuk maakt op mijn voorwaarden?

Als er inbreuk gemaakt wordt op de licentievoorwaarden staat het sanctiesysteem van het auteursrecht voor je open want de Auteurswet 1912, de Wet op naburige rechten en de Databankenwet (plus andere wetsartikelen) zijn onverkort van toepassing op de licenties. Zodoende kan je een gerechtelijke procedure starten en bijvoorbeeld in een kort geding een voorlopige voorziening eisen.

this is why all my music is CC'ed. As a fact : the ripped track is also filed under CC, because that is a requirement to be hosted ion scene.org. I've also got some animations demos, tracks, still frames and such on that server.

Originally posted by : Numtek

this is why all my music is CC'ed. As a fact : the ripped track is also filed under CC, because that is a requirement to be hosted ion scene.org. I've also got some animations demos, tracks, still frames and such on that server. all tracks on ebel are automatically CC'ed too. i wonder if there are any precedents in lawsuits where CC artists won in this kind of situation. when you're with buma/stemra they handle it for you but if you're CC you have to organize it yourself. i'm curious about what the chances for winning in such a case are then.

by tempestflt on 1/12/07 [comment buried, show commenthide comment] + 21 diggs bury this digg this I came here to clear up some things...

Seems like many of the people writing here didn't even bother to listen closely to 'Acidjazzed Evening' (referred as AE from now on) and 'Do It' (referred is DI from now on), or are just plain tonedeaf. Maybe it would help if I'd explain what those songs have and don't have in common. Grab your headphones, because they really help spotting the stuff in DI that got sampled!

First: the basis of the song DI is the intro from AE. If you want to spot the similarities, then don't listen AE longer than 15 seconds, which holds 16 bars of music (no, DI is not "quoting" AE - 1-2 seconds would be quoting). There is not a single part in DI that is not based on these 16 bars. In the chorus of DI, the sampled part is cut into half and only the first half of it is being used, played over and over till the next verse, when the whole sample is being played again.

AE repeats it's intro-theme at some point, but mainly it goes to another directions. If you have hard time finding the resemblance between AE and DI, then don't listen AE for more than 15 seconds. This is crucial.

What was sampled? For DI someone sampled the intro of GRG's C64-version of AE, but with disabling the bass-channel. The bassline was reconstructed in DI - no, It's not "totally different" than AE's bassline as someone said. It's just a stripped down version, with octave intervals removed (fe. A2-A3 -> A2) and 2-3 notes left out. There are 6 different chords (of which many are repeated) in AE's intro, jazzy kind of chords that for most I dont even know their names, but I'll list them here to show that it's not a typical pop-song chord-progression (actually if someone can find a similar chord-progression, I'll give him a beer or two): G# C C# F | A# C# F G# | G# C# D# F | F# A# C# F | A# C D# G# | G# C D# F Each column represents a list of notes used in each chord. It's not the actual chord-progression, but a list of the 6 chords (most popsongs have around 3-4 chords all together) used in the intro, but I think you get the point...

The chords are arpeggiated, which means that the notes in the chord are being played at the same time, but being rapidly from lowest note to the highest and not at the same time. This is a crucial point for anyone who can differentiate a clear note from a dog bark and because chords are not usually played like this, unless you're a superfast heavy metal guitar player, J. C. Bach or a 80s homecomputer-soundchip with only 3 channels available. But in mainstream pop music? No chance.

The melody? Listen to AE's intro few times and then listen to DI with headphones on. It's all there, playing in the background. The melody that Nelly sings is kind of a variation of the melody in AE's intro, but the original melody is also there, in the background of DI! Here's another crucial point; they didn't remove the original melody, but only lowered down it's volume and placed another melody (which Nelly sings) on top of it. I'd call this counterpoint, if the the people behind DI wouldn't be such hacks. If you want to verify my claim about the melody, then don't pay much attention to what Nelly is singing (or the drums) but everything else what is there; bassline, "background-melody" and the arpeggiated chords.

There you have it. 16 bars of music, a whole verse, which became about 4 verses in the hands of another.

I can't discuss the legal issues here. Let's just say that Big Record Companies are surely the works of The Devil. Spread the word...

-tempest by tempestflt 21 hours ago [comment buried, show commenthide comment] + 8 diggs bury this digg this I'll make one more remark and then I'm out:

"First of all you have to prove that Timbaland heard your track before he made his track. "

Acidjazzed Evening competed in Oldschool Music Compo at Assembly 2000 in Helsinki, infront of more than 4000 people (voters) and won the competition. There are good documents on this. You can of course believe that the whole event never took place, but would require heavy dose of self-deluding and not doing your research properly.

And no, I haven't given the copyrights of AE to anyone. Competing with a piece of music/graphics/whatever hardly ever involves giving up the copyright.

And for the one who talked about "similar chordprogression and bpm": did you read my post? There's 16 bars of melody aswell. Take 16 bars from any any memorable theme and see/hear what I mean...

"Why would he steal from you? He would lose credibility and cash."

You'll have to ask him. I know the whole things sounds very impropable... or does it really? Do we really know how often things like these happen? My song was easy to spot, because of the "C64ish" chipsounds I used, but what about songs that use "regular" instruments? And even if record companies pay compensation for the original composer they "borrow" from, they still might earn more from it than they lose. Loose-album has sold 2,5 million copies already and it's not just about the record sales, but also about touring, gaining loads of money by filling big arenas etc. Nelly Furtado is a product.

...and from what I see, Timbaland didn't lose cash but gained cash!

One more notice: I wouldn't recommend Gloom's video, atleast for "skeptics". He misses some key points there, uses bad set of examples - for example he even uses the later variation of the AE's intro's melody and not the actual intromelody. That's why he has to cut it off quicky, because the end of the melody is a bit different from the one that got sampled in DI. I do have to admit that the final demonstration in the video, with both songs played simultaniously, is charming =). The video might work as a good hint, but don't expect it to prove anything. Do your own research/listening. (There's a good set of mp3-examples as torrent, by some unknown individual.)

-tempest

EDIT: MORE PROOF!

all tracks on ebel are automatically CC'ed too. i wonder if there are any precedents in lawsuits where CC artists won in this kind of situation. when you're with buma/stemra they handle it for you but if you're CC you have to organize it yourself. i'm curious about what the chances for winning in such a case are then. sorry for this copy&paste in dutch, but it's like 8:45 and I'm not going to translate this all. International people: just follow the links:

Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen.

voorbeeld. Wil diegene nu opstaan die het lachend opneemt tegen Universal Music Group? of had ik nog niet gezegd dat Timbaland's label gekocht is door UMG? Dan starten we nu ronde #1 tegen de jurdische afdeling van dhr. Doug Morris Doug Morris

Dough Morris's UMG is eigenaar van het label van Eminem, om even een voorbeeld te noemen. Dough Morris's UMG heeft een marktaandeel van 25.5%. Wereldwijd. Op alle muziek. Alles. Dough Morris's UMG is eignaar van je ouders hun Wim Sonneveld's collectie Dough Morris's UMG is via Vivendi eignaar van Blizard. Wat?? Ook World of Warcraft? Juist.

Ik pak eeven een voorbeeld om m'n punt duidelijk te maken:

Beastie Boys - 'Root Down' Gebruikte samples 'Root Down' "Root Down (And Get It)" by Jimmy Smith - Root Down (And Get It) by Jimmy Smith

"Jimmy Smith is my man, I'd like to give him a pound" Perfect gedocumenteerd, gevraagd, betaald, geregeld, handreiking gegeven in de titel, de lyrics, tof, geen probleem. 1 google hit en ik weet precies wie gesampled is waar in deze track. Dit is niet het normale, respectvole pad dat meneer Timbaland heeft bewandeld,.. :nee:

:)

EDIT: MEER BEWIJS! (klik!)

Originally posted by : Numtek Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen. that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

Originally posted by : dtr

Originally posted by : Numtek Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen. that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

Is it not possible to get a legal assistance insurance for support. In situations when you have the law of them. When they busting your cc agreement.

Originally posted by : MarinuZz

Originally posted by : dtr

[QUOTE]Originally posted by : Numtek Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen. that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

Is it not possible to get a legal assistance insurance for support. In situations when you have the law of them. When they busting your cc agreement.[/QUOTE] wablieft? :))